“An ounce of action is worth a ton of theory.” — Ralph Waldo Emerson
Today, you can listen to podcasts, watch videos, read blog posts, and have endless discussions on Linkedin and Twitter about AI.
But what really matters is what you put into action and how you actually use it to save you time, help you do things you couldn’t do before, or get better results.
From my observations, the delta between what is possible for PMs and what PMs are doing today is quite wide.
While AI trailblazers are going deep, building tools for themselves, making podcasts and courses to teach others, and creating new, innovative ways to do more, faster, most PMs are busy doing the work and many are falling behind.
Today’s post is to help you and any PMs on your team quickly and easily catch up to what is possible today with AI.
How to Use AI to be a Better PM Today.
While you don’t hear much about AI hallucinating anymore, the fear still exists. It’s easy to think that spending a lot of time using AI just leads to wasted cycles and questionable results.
Fortunately, each of these suggestions are battle tested and well within the capabilities of AI. And where there are potential issues, I’ll call them out so you can keep them in mind.
Have you written one of those “It’s Time to Embrace AI” memos to your team like we’ve seen go viral from Shopify, Duolingo, or Box?
How has that gone for you?
Best laid plans…
While everyone knows they should be using AI, changing behaviors is hard.
And learning a new skill and technology that’s unlike past generations of tools is even harder.
Yet, too often, founders and executives think they can just order their team to do it, and magically everyone will embrace AI and get all the benefits we hear hyped online.
I recently worked with a client helping them improve their AI adoption. There I saw even smart, capable people weren’t using AI very often beyond some basic questions to ChatGPT. I learned the real problem isn’t awareness nor desire; the reality is it comes down to problems like time, uncertainty, and trust.
Today’s post breaks down what worked (and what didn’t) in helping a team move from curiosity to consistent AI use, and gives you practical approaches to apply to changing the AI culture at your team, whether you need to get everyone, or a slow adopter or two, on board.
One of the most common frustrations with AI is not getting what you wanted. For every time we get just what we wanted (or more), it seems like we also get a mess of nonsense or things we know are wrong.
And sometimes that happens, because the job is literally impossible for the AI.
Other times, we didn’t write a good enough prompt. Going back to the drawing board, providing some examples, and giving more detailed specifics can help get a better result the next time.
Yet, sometimes none of that is enough, even if it *should* be possible.
“The square root of slop is slop.”
Some friends and I were talking about the state of AI and noticing how you can get plausible sounding ideas and analysis, but when you dig in, you see it’s completely wrong.
Sometimes that’s hallucinated entries in a spreadsheet that doesn’t actually add up correctly, despite looking great. Other times, it’s customer feedback analysis of thousands of entries, with a beautiful report and quotes, where you can’t actually confirm the underlying sources that led to the ranking of problems it offered. Or, it’s simply a report or newsletter draft that starts out sounding good before drifting off to classic AI generated slop.
As my friend put it, “If AI is just math at scale, then scaling noise just gives you louder nonsense.” Or put more simply and more memorably, “the square root of slop is slop.”
Running a startup puts a ton of responsibilities on your plate. From marketing to sales, hacky-HR to accounting, development to project management, you’re wearing a million hats.
The same can be true for Product Managers. You can find yourself involved in many projects, tons of meetings, and more competing priorities from your stakeholders than you’d like.
Yet, through all this busy-ness, whether you’re an early stage founder, or a product manager, you need to make time to talk to customers. It’s the lifeblood of building something people want, getting to Product-Market Fit, and launching successful new products and features.
As you commit yourself to “getting outside the building” to talk to your customers, it’s essential you make the most of those discussions.
Talking to customers…but how?
One of the hardest things for newcomers to customer development and product management to get right is the questions they ask in their interviews.
Done well, you can learn priceless insights that help you prioritize and build the right things, while descoping things that turn out not to matter. Done poorly, you fail to get sufficient signal across interviews, and waste you and your customer’s time.
Fortunately, I’m here to help you today.
I’ve taught dozens of product managers and founders this process hands on (and thousands more through posts like these), and it’s led to fantastic results for them. By using this structure, you avoid biasing your customers or putting them on the defensive. You also maximize your learning so that you can get the best insights in the fewest number of interviews.
With that in mind, let’s dive in, so you can learn how to have great customer interviews, too.
How to Structure (and get the most out of) Your Customer Development Interviews
The biggest mistake I see otherwise well-intentioned founders and PMs make is that they come to their customer interviews with no preparation.
Showing up and just saying, “Tell me about…” or “What do you think of my demo/product?” is a huge missed opportunity; you don’t know what you don’t know at that point, and lose out on a lot of great insights you could learn if you asked the right questions, in the right order.
Ask the right questions at the right time.
You can make a great impression and learn a lot more by following this simple, 3-step process I share below: 1) People, 2) Problems, and then 3) Your Solution.
A few quick notes before we break those down:
Timing: Depending on the person, this question flow generally takes 30-45 minutes to go through. If you can get a customer to agree to a 1 hour call, that’s ideal, but you can prioritize the best questions if you have only 30 minutes.
Business Model: This structure is best suited to B2B customer development, but with a little creativity, you can definitely adapt this for B2C interviews, especially if the B2C product involves the customer making a direct purchase (i.e.- subscription or e-commerce).
Order: This order (People -> Problems -> Your Solution) is extremely intentional. You must go in this order, or it will hurt your results of your interviews. More on why later in this post.
With that in mind, let’s take a look at the 3 sections, in order:
1) People – Aka – Who Are You Interviewing?
Before you get into anything about problems, or your solution, you need to figure out who you’re actually talking to. This both warms up your interviewee with some softball questions and gives you an opportunity to build some rapport with them.
It also helps you get to know them and the parts of their life around the edges of the problems you’re potentially solving for them.
Important: Do not shortchange this opening section of questions!
You don’t need a novel on their daily life, but you *do need* enough to be able to understand their role within their company, who key players are, and a general baseline of their sophistication.
All of this will help you later pattern match who the user type that is most receptive to the problem you’re solving and the solution you offer, as well as who is not a fit. This is priceless for your product, your marketing, and your sales processes.
Some example questions you can ask:
What is your name and role at your company? (If you can find this out in advance, always look it up to save asking the question)
How do you fit into your company’s department structure? Overall in the company?
How do you discover new products for work? Do you need any approval to try them?
Have you tried anything new recently? How did it work for you?
What is a typical day like on your job?What are you main routines?
What is your budget like? Who has to approve your purchases?
How much time do you spend doing [task X]? (Task X being anything they mentioned in their typical day that stood out to you or related to your product/business)
Pro Tip: When you’re preparing for your interviews, give yourself a section before your People questions to fill in things you can look up on your own.
This can be things like: Their name, Job Title, Company Website, Linkedin profile, Company name/size/industry, location, internal analytics profile from your company, and anything else you can find out about them that shows context about who they are and their behavior in your product.
Then, add any questions to your script that come to mind as you gather this info to really make the most of your interviews like their usage of parts of your product, unusual things in their profile, etc.
Going into these interviews, I never know which aspects of getting to know them will be the key, which is why adding the extra notes beforehand helps; you’ll be looking back at all your interviews to figure out what common patterns and differentiators are.
2) Problems – Aka – What are your greatest pains?
This section is where you try to find out whether the person has the problem you believe you’re solving. Your goal is to not lead them to your problem. The less you lead them while still hearing your problem being mentioned, the more validation you have!
People love to talk about themselves, so let them go nuts here and really rant about their problems (i.e.- Shut up 🤐 and listen!). Generally, people are terrible at proposing solutions, but you want to hear generally what they envision as solutions or see what they’ve cobbled together themselves.
Some sample questions you can ask:
What are your biggest initiatives and goals right now? How are they going so far? (To understand their priorities and which they need help with most)
What are your top 3 challenges you face in your job right now? Why did you choose those? Why that order?
What are your top 3 challenges you face in your job related to [industry X]? (Industry X being the one your startup/business is in)
If you could wave a magic wand and instantly have a solution to any of those problems…what would the solution be?
Dig deeper into their typical day on anything that sounds painful or expensive. (You can add some hyperbole here to get them to rant a bit by saying things like “that sounds inefficient…” or “that sounds expensive…”)
How have you dealt with or solved [Problem X] so far? (You’re looking to find out if they’ve hacked a solution together themselves. If they have…ask for a copy of it!)
How does your work in this area interact with your coworkers? (Look for collaboration problems, needed features, and others you should interview)
What do you have to report to your manager or other teams related to this? (Look for reporting needs, buyer expectations, and how this problem may impact others)
Notice, you haven’t mentioned your solution, nor problem yet. If they don’t mention your problem specifically, then as you finish this section of questioning, you can directly ask them if what you think is a problem is a problem for them. Whether they agree it’s a problem or not, you want to then probe why it wasn’t one of their top problems.
The beauty of this approach is that you’ll learn a lot about their day to day, and what they perceive as their most pressing problems. This can often help refine what you’re working on, or reveal a pivot that can change the fate or trajectory of your business.
3) Your Solution – Aka – See if your idea survives customer interaction
In your discussions in part 2, if your interviewee brings up your problem you think you’re solving, then you’re on the right track! Bonus points if the way they describe solving it with their “magic wand” remotely resembles what you’re doing.
No matter what happens in part 2 you should discuss with them what you thought the problem was and what your solution is. Getting validation that they wouldn’t be interested in the idea is just as helpful as finding out they love it; either they’re not a customer, or you are learning what your customers want instead.
Some sample questions you could ask:
Walk them through the problems you believe your solution solves. Do they agree?
Does [your solution] solve any of your problems?Why or why not?
What looks most helpful or important to you?How will that help you?
What’s missing from what I’ve shown you to help solve your problems? Why is that important to you?
How do you see this fitting into your routines? What would be important to make it fit well for you?
Who else on your team, or at your company, would be interested in this?How do you think it would help them?
Would you be willing to pay for our solution? What budget do you have for something like this? (Don’t be afraid to probe for the pricing you know you want…”Would [X] be reasonable?” It’s imperfect but gets you started.)
If they’re willing to pay for your product and like the idea then… “Would you be willing/ready to start right away?”
If all goes well and you really are solving a pain, then your customer should want access to your product or new feature right away. More likely, you’re going to learn a ton about what they do and do not want and your idea will begin evolving. You’ll also find out others at the company you may want to talk to that have needs if your customer will start using your product.
Keep in mind: The way you present the solution can be flexible for the state of your business or the development of this feature:
Describe it in words: Tell them what you have in mind, or sketch it on a napkin or paper.
Show them mockups: Share your screen or turn your laptop/tablet towards them to show what you have in mind.
Send them a clickable prototype: Especially if you’re interviewing them on video, sending a prototype link is a great way for them to see and feel what you have in mind. (In that case ask them to share their screen and narrate their thoughts as they go through it)
Give them staging or feature-flagged access: Once you’ve launched, this is the most powerful because they can try it exactly as you intended. (And again, have them share their screen and narrate.)
In all cases, the goal is to give them something they can react to. Don’t let the simplicity of what you have stop you from learning.
In fact, you can learn a ton in these interviews when you literally have nothing to talk about in the Solution section; I’ve launched products and new features multiple times where the first round of interviews had little to no solution discussion, and we only followed up later for solution-focused feedback built on what we learned in the People & Problem sections.
Making the most of your customer interviews
This basic structure can carry you a long way towards some great validated learning about your idea and your market’s desire for it. It can help refine your idea or feature, help you determine if you should pivot, and reveal new opportunities that can help you grow faster.
There’s a few more things to keep in mind that I’ve learned over time. Applying these tips can help you become a real pro at interviewing customers.
1) Take good notes and record everything!
Once you’ve interviewed 8-10 people, you should be going back over all of your notes and look for patterns. This includes especially looking for patterns in the Part 1 section to see what all the people that agree you are solving their problem have in common.
Summarize your notes then and share with your team, so everyone benefits from what you learned, and you can iterate together on your solution based on what you learned.
In particular, having a recording (and more recently, AI transcription) can really help here, because then you can re-listen to and review great interviews, as well as share snippets or the whole interview with your colleagues.
2) Have other team members sit in on some interviews
A good customer development focused company will have everyone involved in the process. Performable, pre-HubSpot acquisition, had their engineers spending 30% of their time on the phone with customers. Nothing helps someone do their job better like understanding who they’re building/selling/marketing for.
Using a script like this should not feel like an interview! They should feel like they’re just having a conversation with a friend about their problems at work. The more comfortable they feel with you, the more they will open up. This is part of the value and intention of the People section of questions.
By preparing your interview script in advance, you can more confidently run your interviews knowing exactly what you want to talk about. Be sure to use language that feels comfortable and natural to you, and don’t be afraid to iterate on any questions that aren’t getting the response you hoped.
4) Go off script
The best insights comes when you dig a little deeper on something that strikes a chord in the discussion. The script is there to be your roadmap, but there’s no reason you can’t return to it after a 5 minute digression about a specific pain, or discovery about how the company operates.
5) If they’ve made an MVP…ask to see it!
Nothing gives you more insight to a customer than what they’ve hacked together themselves to solve a problem. The best thing you can do is ask to see it, which will give you an idea of what they’re hoping your solution will provide. These people are also the strongest candidates to be great, helpful early adopters of your product.
If the hacked solution is actually a competitor’s product they’re frustrated with, ask them to share what they love and hate about it; that’s just as valuable as any hacked or cobbled together solution.
6) Always follow up
It’s common courtesy to thank people for their time and help. It also opens the door to follow up with them in the future if your product changes and is a fit for them, or to invite them to try it out when it’s live/launched.
Also, if you promised a free gift card (or other compensation) for their time, be sure to keep your promises and send it to them promptly. And if you hear about any bugs they report, be sure to fix them and then let them know.
All of these things score major points and make a great impression, which will make it easier to get people to interview in the future as well as build good will with current and future customers.
7) End with an ask
Always end your interviews by thanking them and asking them for something. It may be to get a copy of their MVP, or even better, ask for an intro to someone they know that might be interested in what you’re working on.
In my experience, these intros have an 80-90% success rate in becoming new customer development interviews, whereas cold emails asking customers you’ve never spoken with only have a roughly 10% success rate.
8) Be open to new problems! That’s how great products are born.
As Steve Blank has said, “No idea survives first interaction with a customer.“ Don’t be afraid to shift your focus from your first idea to what you’re actually hearing customers want. If you probe in part 2 and find a burning problem…find out how they currently solve it and what they’d pay to solve it.
Sometimes these shifts are subtle, because what you thought was most important is secondary to a bigger problem. That’s when you tell marketing and sales about a shift in positioning.
Other times, this is a huge shift and you need to change what you’re building significantly. That’s when you should have a bigger team-wide discussion.
Either way, having detailed notes, recordings of your calls, and some examples from customers of what they want instead can be the difference between what you found falling on deaf ears, or being embraced as strong evidence of a change in focus or full blown pivot being necessary.
—
In the end, you want to find a “hair on fire” problem, not a “nice to have problem.” Think about it this way: If my hair is on fire (literally), and you’re selling buckets of water, I’m definitely going to buy your product. But if I’m cold and wet, I’m not likely to buy your bucket of water right now, but might consider it in the future.
Find customer pain and a solution they desire and will pay for. Rinse. Repeat.
From launching your first product, to adding the nth feature to your company’s product suite, interviewing customers is an essential skill. By using the People -> Problem -> Solution framework and being well prepared for each interview, you can spend more time building the right things and less time adding things that no one cares about.
Further Reading:
Looking to truly master the art and science of interviewing customers? Read these other posts:
If you’ve been a PM for more than 5 minutes, you’ve heard this question, which is much easier to ask than answer.
Making matters worse, the question is central to what you do as a Product Manager, while largely being beyond your control; you don’t write the code, nor fix the bugs. The best you can do is help with scope, testing, and relaying information when everyone needs it.
Yet, there’s more you can do to help ship features on time than you may think, which is what we’re covering today.
How to Help Your Engineers make Better Feature Delivery Estimates
When you make the lives of the engineers and designers you work with easier, everything gets better; they enjoy working with you more, it becomes easier to make requests of them, and delivery often happens on a more consistent basis.
And to get all those benefits, it starts with YOU.
Before you start pointing fingers at engineers who “can’t hit a deadline” or “stink at estimating”, try some of these approaches to do your part.
You may be surprised how much this boosts your product team’s morale, and how much more accurate the estimate you receive from engineering become.
1) Break your tasks and projects into smaller pieces.
One of the biggest mistakes I see inexperienced product managers make is to plan for grandiose, multi-month (or multi-quarter!) projects. They have a grand vision of solving every little problem possible and completely re-imaging a part of the product that they own.
While this may feel great for your ego, and even be a bit inspiring to others, it’s a recipe for disaster in practice.
Big Projects = Big Misses.
The fact is, it’s very hard to estimate big projects; the larger the span or reach of the project, the more things that can go wrong unexpectedly, and the more dependencies start to stack up. No matter how experienced an engineer is, it’s hard to accurately estimate massive projects. No one can foresee everything that will come up at that point.
That’s why breaking your projects into smaller pieces is so valuable.
Think about it: If I give you a roughly day long task, and you’re off by 50%, that’s only half a day.
That isn’t that big a deal, and is unlikely to sink your plans and other commitments.
Yet, if I estimate a project will take a month and I’m off by 50%, well, now we have to spend an extra 2 weeks on it. That does start to impact the rest of your roadmap and best laid plans.
Best of all, by breaking your projects up into smaller pieces it forces you to:
Prioritize the most important work: You can’t have everything, but you can make sure you get the most important things done.
Have real discussions about tradeoffs: Smaller projects means fewer points in your project management tool, so you open up discussions about real tradeoffs instead of simply piling on more to do.
Think about big projects in phases: Do you really need to wait to have *everything* you can dream of, or can you launch in phases, possibly even pausing work between phases to give attention to other needy parts of your product?
All of these are good discussions and thought experiments to have as a product leader. By practicing them proactively, you’ll improve your relationship with the engineers you work with, because now your requests won’t feel like you’re always asking for mountains to be moved.
2) Give your Engineers a heads up for unknowns and complex projects.
Quick: You have 5 minutes to think through all the consequences of a massive project that will probably take 3 or more months. Make accurate estimates, and start making project tickets now, because this conference room is reserved for someone else in 22 minutes.
Sounds unreasonable, right?
Yet, that’s exactly what a lot of PMs do. They come to sprint planning meetings with enormous projects that are only defined at a high level.
No wonder engineers miss deadlines. They’re given an impossible task.
an underappreciated programming skill is time estimation — not just communicating how long something should take you, but noticing when you've spent too long on a particular approach and should revisit
Start your discussion well before sprint planning.
You know who the tech lead, scrum master, or other lead planner is on your product team. That means you should start the discussion with them early when it comes to bigger projects or greater uncertainty.
I’ve always found that if I come to the right engineer with a sticky problem or complex question, they’re excited to dig in and see what they can figure out. They’ll then come back with:
What the hard parts about that task/project are
What they think is reasonably possible
Approaches they suggest are hard vs. easy
Rough time estimates for various part of the work
Suggestions for further research and discussion
The key to all of this though is timing.
While coming the day before sprint planning is better than not coming at all, what you really want to do is give them a week or two warning.
That gives them more flexibility on when they look into it, and it gives them time to really marinate on their answer.
I often find the best engineers will do this over multiple days, talk to some friends and coworkers, test a few things, read some docs, and ultimately come back with a super informed answer IF I give them enough forewarning so that they have time to do it (while completing the rest of their work commitments, of course).
As Ben Franklin said, “an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.” You can save your team a lot of headaches from poor estimations by given your engineers a heads up so they can do more research for your larger and more complex asks.
3) Be flexible on scope, but firm on outcomes.
To be successful long term, product managers have to be pragmatic. If you try to control every detail, and you’re rigid in your approach, don’t expect to deliver a lot. You’ll also frustrate your engineers and designer to no end.
One of the best ways to lead your product team to successful outcomes that are delivered reasonably close to on schedule is to be flexible on how you solve problems, while holding firm to solving the most important problems for your customers.
The truth is, customers do not care how hard or easy what you delivered was. All they care about is if you solved their problem.
Something many founders learn far too late, myself included, is customers simply don't care how hard it is to do your job. Yes, a few might feel bad that you're killing yourself to deliver, but on the whole, they only care about one thing:
Surprises happen. Timelines slip. Fires come up that have to be dealt with. You can’t let projects drag on month over month or quarter over quarter.
When issues inevitably come up, you have to find the right things to compromise on. That means knowing what to fight for and what you can be flexible on. Be prepared to answer questions like:
What outcomes are must-have for your customers? There are times where not having something defeats the entire purpose of the feature. You can’t cut that. Fight to keep it in your plans, and explain why so everyone understands your resistance.
What is the 80/20 (Pareto principle) of this feature? Yes, we’d all LOVE to build everything we can dream of, but when racing to product/market fit, or simply overrun by roadmap demands, you have to focus on the highest impact aspects. What will add the most value for the least effort or number of features?
What can wait? It helps if you already have a few things in your back pocket that you’re okay de-scoping from a project. Maybe it can fit in a “Phase 2” of a project, or you can squeeze it in as part of a quick iteration post launch.
The beauty of a high performing product team is that you don’t have to have all the answers. Engaged engineers and designers want to help you get the best outcomes for customers. When you get stuck, they can help you come up with the best solutions given your constraints on time, resources, and tech challenges.
Through all those discussions, it’s your job to keep things anchored in the reality of what needs done. That means remembering the metrics and outcomes you’re driving towards so you cut and keep the right things.
4) Write clear, concise, effective product specs
You know what often precedes a poorly planned sprint? A poorly written product spec.
You get out what you put in, and too many PMs shortchange their product specs. They either rush them, so they only have half of the information needed, or they bloat them with so much fluff and fill that no one wants to read them.
Both of those extremes are recipes for disaster.
Great product specs are a precursor to accurate estimates.
When you give your engineers and designers a product spec that covers everything they need to know, and makes clear the priorities, it’s much easier for your product team to come up with the best possible solution within the constraints you have.
Unfortunately, a lot of product specs shortchange this kind of information, sometimes even spending a lot of time dictating the solution to their engineers and designers instead.
Don’t do that.
Instead, make sure your product spec includes key information including:
Why are we working on this? This sets the narrative and should share the hard data that justifies making this the priority to work on.
What problems do we need to solve? These should clearly lay out what this project should address. They should be ranked so you’re all on the same page, and know what can and can’t be cut.
What are future considerations for this? You can’t always build everything you want, but by having a section for this, you help your team make better decisions anticipating these things coming. This will save you time & frustration later, and gives you a clear place to move things that get descoped.
What is our KPI/OKR/Metric for this? This ties back to your why. It helps measure success or failure and keeps everyone focused on what you’re trying to do. Remember: shipping is not success as a PM. Driving successful business outcomes is.
Creating a succinct, clear, and effective product spec is a big challenge and an important skill for every PM to master. If you think yours could use a tune up, check out How to write a Product Thesis,which I learned from Silicon Valley investor and product leader, Josh Elman.
Product specs are a high leverage activity for product managers; when you do the work to have the right information and then organize it well into a quality spec, you may be surprised how much easier it is to work with your engineers and designer. Your improvement in this area will then set up your team to give you better estimates.
5) Talk about estimates and scope before you plan a sprint
Yeah, I know. Who wants another meeting?!? In this case you do.
One of the most powerful meetings you can have comes from the meeting before the sprint planning meeting.
In this meeting, you go over your product spec, talk about the project goals, and then bounce ideas around until you settle on what’s possible given the needs, constraints, and possibilities everyone comes up with.
This is literally my favorite part of being a product manager, yet it seems many people don’t know about it nor do it.
Thankfully, Steve Jobs led the way on these.
Steve Jobs and the Cauldron
No, this isn’t some kitschy Product Manager’s children’s book. It’s a real thing that Steve Jobs did at Apple regularly. As shared by Glenn Reid, who worked with Jobs at both NeXT and Apple, cauldrons are a magical small group meeting where great products are born:
"When I worked with Steve on product design, there was kind of an approach we took, unconsciously, which I characterize in my mind as a "cauldron."
There might be 3 or 4 or even 10 of us in the room, looking at, say, an iteration of iPhoto. Ideas would come forth, suggestions, observations, whatever. We would "throw them into the cauldron", and stir it, and soon nobody remembered exactly whose ideas were which.
This let us make a great soup, a great potion, without worrying about who had what idea. This was critically important, in retrospect, to decouple the CEO from the ideas. If an idea was good, we'd all eventually agree on it, and if it was bad, it just kind of sank to the bottom of the pot. We didn't really remember whose ideas were which -- it just didn't matter."
Most importantly, this small group discussion focused on creating the best possible outcomes for customers:
"...it wasn't magic, it was hard work, thoughtful design, and constant iteration. Doing the best we knew how with what was available, shaping each release into a credible, solid, useful, product, as simple and direct as we could make it. And we shipped those products, most importantly."
You have great engineering and design resources on your team. Why would you not want to involve them in coming up with the best possible features?!?
When you know you have constraints to work within, and want to create the best product, then you should be like Jobs and leave your ego at the door. It should not matter if YOU came up with the idea; it should matter only that your product team delivered the best possible product to your customers.
And that comes by meeting to discuss ideas in a free form, creative way, like the cauldrons Steve Jobs used to have.
Then, once you have all the best ideas, and have accounted for the goals, constraints, deadlines, and demands of the project, now, you can move to the nitty gritty details of sprint plans and detailed estimates.
By having this discussion before any estimating, you give you and your team room to consider a variety of ideas. The end result will turn out to be better than anything you or any peer could have come up with alone.
Better solutions, better outcomes, all with better estimates. What more could you ask for?
You have more control over engineering estimates than you think.
You’ll notice none of these suggestions involve playing project manager. None of them involve standing over your engineers barking orders, nor criticizing and complaining, either.
Instead, it gives you ownership over a process that addresses the issues that often exist upstream of engineering estimate issues.
When these areas are done well, you’ll often find a lot of your other problems go away; not only will your engineers improve their estimation ability, but your working relationships will improve, morale goes up, and you will likely start shipping more product with better outcomes.
Do you need help with your product team?
I help VPs of Product, Heads of Product, and 1st PMs at early stage startups that are struggling with critical issues like churn, growth, product velocity, product team dynamics, and stakeholder relationships.
If you launch a feature and you don’t tell anyone, did you really launch it?
Okay, maybe the “tree falls in a forest” analogy isn’t perfect, but you probably get the point: you need to tell your customers when you make improvements.
But how do you do it in a way that customers will care?
I’ve seen dozens of ways for people to do product updates over the years, including these common ones:
Popping up in app to tell them (think Intercom-style, or a product tour)
Posting on your company blog
Emailing to everyone who has an account
Passing it to sales or account management to tell customers
Updating a change log that lists all updates over time
Praying they stumble upon the changes
Of all of those, my favorite is the semi-regular email to customers.
I like it for a few reasons:
Flexible medium: I can write and include images and gifs to clearly show what’s new.
Non-interruptive: Unlike pop ups in app, they can read this when they have time, instead of dismissing it when they’re in the middle of something in your product.
Reminder we exist: People get busy. You are not the center of their universe. An email about product improvements can get people back into your product they haven’t logged into in a while because they see you in their inbox.
For the past 10+ years, I’ve been sending product updates at the SaaS companies I’ve worked at and founded. Because of the structure I follow, I’ve seen it help build stronger relationships with customers, reduce churn, and help everyone feel more product momentum.
Today, I’ll show you my process so you can experience those benefits with your customers, too.
How to Write Product Updates that Delight Customers & Reduce Churn
First and foremost, credit where credit is due. There was an AWESOME Tweetstorm from Steven Sinofsky on this subject. It’s since been taken down, but you canread it in full here.
WordPress also saved the text of some of the tweets, which I’ll share some highlights throughout this post.
Okay, so now that you read his 20 tweets, you understand why this is important, and the pitfalls to avoid. Now, let’s talk about how to actually write one.
A few assumptions:
You talk to customers: If you talk to customers, all of this is easy to do. If you don’t, not only is this very hard to do, but you are a disgrace to product managers everywhere. Worst of all, your designers and engineers are rolling their eyes at you. Want to fix that? Jump here on my blog to learn how to talk to customers.
You’re data informed: Quantitative numbers are not everything, but they’re very important. They help you understand how many people are affected by a problem, the total addressable audience for a feature, and measure the impact of a change. Having these numbers is key for both internal buy in and explaining things to your customers.
You have buy-in: The bigger your company, the more stakeholders you need to manage. It’s good to get things done, and it’s also good to keep people in the loop who also interact with customers or care about this. Use your best judgment on who may want to see what you’re doing. If you get resistance, try to get support for an experiment of sending them.
If you’ve done those 3 things, you’re ready to apply these tactics to make an awesome product / feature update.
1) Start with a “Thank You”
Every product update I take the time to write out a list of thank yous to customers that took time to report bugs, share feedback, answer questions, or do customer development interviews.
This costs you *nothing*, but can mean a lot.
First, you’re letting people know you were really listening. It reminds them that their input matters and the time they took out of their day to email you, hop on a call, or beta test a feature was worth it.
It also creates a reinforcing loop:
You thank someone for feedback.
Others see that you thanked people for feedback and it gets them thinking about giving feedback.
Coworkers see their colleague’s name and talk about it, think about using the product more, and consider giving feedback as well.
Next month, the list grows, and you have more people to thank.
Immediately after I give thank you shout outs, I also then remind people just how easy it is to give us feedback, so I teach more customers what to do:
Remember: You want a product people LOVE or HATE.
Silence is your enemy.
Make more people care by letting them know you’re listening. The feedback and problems they share help you build a better product, and improve adoption throughout a company or network.
2) Tell your story
Every product has a mission and vision. As a product manager, you need to understand and lead that vision. It should impact everything you do, including what you write in your product updates.
The best way to manage expectations with customers is to guide them on the journey of your product.
Ask yourself questions like:
Where is our product heading? What is the big picture?
Why are we heading in that direction?
How does our direction help our customers be more awesome?
What won’t we be doing? Why not those things?
As you explain each update and change, you should keep those questions in mind. Make sure what you tell people aligns with that goal.
For example, with Lighthouse, our focus is on making managers great. We know they’re busy, so things like speed and performance in our product is as important as a new, shiny feature. We need to work reliably for them.
That meant that when we had a product outage due to Mandrill failing, we decide to switch email providers to Postmark. Here’s how we framed that:
Obviously, this is a very simple version of a story. For new, big features, there’s *a lot* more I would speak to explaining how we think it fits their workflow, why it matters, and how it fits into everything they do.
3) Explain your reasoning
While telling your story is important, it’s also helpful to have a rational side to it. What was the motivation for this decision?
If you’re doing product management right, you already wrote a product spec or product thesis that explains to your internal team why you’re choosing to work on this feature next. You should translate that same quantitative and qualitative data to a version that makes sense to share with your customers.
As Sinofsky points out, if you don’t give people a reason, they’ll make one up. So plan to give them a good one.
A feature can be commonly requested, but you don’t build it because it doesn’t fit your vision and mission. A feature can also be less commonly requested, but only because people can’t use your product until you build an integration they would need.
Either way, you would want to explain your decision. Tell people why you chose this of all the things you could do.
Maybe you have a Slack integration, and with all the hype and press around Microsoft Teams, you realize it makes sense to allow MS Teams users to do what you already allow in Slack.
Or maybe your company is moving up market and that means building some permissioning and security is now more important. Your SMB customers may not be as excited, but if you can help paint the picture that, “one day your business may grow and you’ll want to use these, too” can give them a better feeling about it. Explaining the upmarket move can then also signal to your handful of current, big customers that you are investing more in what matters to them.
If you just say, “We built some new security features” with a list of bullets, you give your customers no idea why. Do better than that.
Superhuman sends regular product updates, often with demo Gifs
4) Paint a picture of the future
Your product update is a snapshot in time. It’s one step in an endless journey towards (or keeping) product-market fit.
As important as it is to explain what you built and launched this time, you also should paint a picture for the future. Help people understand and anticipate what is coming.
The key here is to strike a balance. You do *not* want to publish your whole roadmap; it can change too much, and you want to give yourself some flexibility.
At the same time, if people know how you’re thinking and what you’re working towards, they can help you in a variety of ways:
Volunteer to give feedback: If they know you’re building things they’d like, they’re more likely to reach out.
Good customers stay: Most people hate switching products. If they feel like you’re heading in the right direction, they’ll give you time to fix problems and get there.
Tell their friends/colleagues: When a product “just gets me”, you’re much more likely to rave to friends about it. By telling your story for features and where you’re heading, it builds excitement and anticipation for your best fit customers.
Strike the right balance on what you share
Giving just the right amount of detail on the future is definitely a learned skill. However, as a starting point, I like to do the following:
Talk about things under construction: If you’re already committed to and building something it’s pretty safe to hint at it by showing a small snippet, or explaining what it will do.
Focus on themes: Rather than listing the 27 things you hope to do (and could change), tell them thematically about your goal or vision. This could be like saying we’re going to “allow you to do key activities on your phone you told us are important when on the go” instead of listing mobile app features.
5) Seek feedback and input
You should never send something product related that is “no reply”, and this is especially the case for product updates. If people have something to say about what you built, make it as easy as possible for them to share their thoughts.
You can then use this to also recruit people for future customer development based on the upcoming features you’re going to launch, or to get people to take a survey.
Here's one of our many beautiful and informative tiles. (Also the only app to show Early, everyone else lazily lumps it into On Time. 🤷♂️) pic.twitter.com/t3rFBBw6M1
The more you show you’re listening and acting in their interest, the more engaged your customer base becomes.
Creating a virtuous feedback cycle
When I joined KISSmetrics, they were getting about 10 pieces of customer feedback a week from our feedback box in the product. Unfortunately, no one on the team was replying to those for a variety of reasons.
Through being more customer driven, replying to those messages, and sending notes like I’m outlining today, we were able to boost that to getting over 50 pieces of feedback (5X) a week while the customer base doubled. This helped us catch and fix bugs faster, and more easily get insights from our customers.
The easier you make it to give feedback, and the more you respond and act on what you receive, the more feedback you’ll get from customers.
Before long, you’ll find it’s really easy to find and recruit customers for new feature feedback and customer development.
Adapt this to fit your business and audience.
With my startup, Lighthouse, we sell to managers. They’re generally in an office and live in email. This makes an email update great.
Once a month is a good cadence for us to send an update out as it’s a couple sprints, and usually enough to fill up a good update. It also is a frequency that resonates with our audience as they do a lot of their projects in monthly increments.
Your business may be different, so consider changes to what I’ve outlined here like:
Message on another platform: Can you tell them in Slack, via a small text, or somewhere else they’re most likely to check?
Tweak the frequency: Update your customers as often as you think fits your update cadence and your customers want them. More, shorter updates, or fewer, longer ones may make sense.
Use another format: If you’re a video platform, then video updates probably are better. If your business includes a really popular podcast, maybe a quick audio clip fits.
Show your personality: This is a huge opportunity to build your brand, so put some of your company’s personality into it. If your company is nerdy, be nerdy, if it’s playful or irreverent, be irreverent, and if you’re really formal, then your update should be, too.
Involve the right people: Who has the strongest relationship with your customers? They should be in the loop on this. For example, if you have account managers it may be best to have them get the word out, at which point you could draft something they can copy/paste and adapt.
The best way to get to the right format and approach for your customer is to listen and iterate. Get the right people involved in your company and start trying things.
As you build the habit of doing this, you’ll see more of what works and doesn’t so you can work towards getting messages like this from your customers:
How do you update your customers about changes and improvements to your product? Share your favorite tactic in the comments so everyone can learn.
And if you want help mastering key product skills like interviewing customers, writing product specs and updates, driving new growth, and reducing churn, I’m doing a limited number of coaching engagements for VPs of Product and First PMs at startups.
This was originally a 20-Tweet long Tweetstorm by Steven in 2019, but it’s no longer live. I reached out to Steven and he shared the text of those with me, which I’m preserving below. (Note: You can follow Steven on Twitter at @stevensi)
It’s great advice that should not be lost and complements a post on sending product updates I wrote around the same time that incorporated his advice into it. It’s a habit any good product manager should practice.
Steven Sinofsky’s Advice for Product Updates
For this post, anything in italics is Steven’s words, and regular text is my words. Any edits to Steven’s words across these 20 tweets is only for grammar, spelling, or formatting (bold, subheadings, and line breaks were my choices).
Here’s Steven’s advice:
Say your product has a new feature or change and you want to tell everyone about it with a blog post or some tweets. Here are a few things to think about when communicating change to a tech customer base
tl;dr Saying what you did and that customers asked for it isn’t enough.
With SaaS and agile we see many product releases that are primarily incremental feature releases. It might feel like a big release to product team, but to customers it might not be so big. To customers it might just be change. Doesn’t matter how much code it was for you.
For customers, something that is 10% better can often be 100% different. In order to be better, change no matter how big or how small, needs context and motivation for the change.
Who is the change for and why?
Dissatisfaction with change happens when there is a mismatch between expectations and reality. That gap can be closed if expectations have a chance to get set or leveled with context and communication.
The most important thing is never to communicate some change or new aspects to a product in isolation.
Is this it? Is there more? Why?
Product strategy matters.
Customers will invent your strategy if you don’t tell them.
If they are wrong the satisfaction gap widens.
“Why”?
Most common tactic (I say mistake) is to make a change to a product and put out there “people have been asking for this” or “feedback.” If you have more than like 100 users that is just axiomatic. It is also a bit presumptuous—did everyone reading this ask?
It is trivial to make a big deal out of fixing bugs, but that has a thirst to it—like you’re asking for credit for doing the basics of offering a product. People generally don’t ask for bugs to get fixed, they just think less of the product.
“Most requested” is very dangerous. What else was requested? Was there a vote? Why did you do this request and not all the other requests? Where are requests tracked?
In general, requests is not a sustainable approach to prioritization. (Ed note: Steven and I agree on this, which is why I explain in detail, “Why Feature Voting Creates Poor Products “)
What is more interesting than saying something is requested is articulating the reason for doing something that was not requested. That’s why products exist—to solve unarticulated needs not build faster horses. Teams exist to have a vision, not just fix their own mistakes.
When communicating change, it is easy to go into all the details of the change.
What is far more interesting is to explain the problem and then go through the process of how you arrived at this specific solution versus others. Was the change really necessary?
The internet will just do so for you even if you don’t.
You might try explaining that a problem is “ease of use” but unless you have specific flows and scenarios, then others will just come up with different designs and problems.
This is especially true for UI changes.
If you make a UI change you should expect people to ask for the option to turn it off. So in communicating it you should explain why it is the new “one and only” way and what is the strategy behind it.
Offering options is actually really hard in practice, the more options are offered the more people will expect them. So if you do have an option for one change and make a big deal out of it, then expect to be asked for options every time. That’s serious combinatorics.
Most changes have some data behind them—not all but most.
Your case will be much stronger if you present the data you used to make a choice: How many people use X? Is this optimized for mobile or web? What platforms? How slow then, fast now?
If you don’t present data but imply there is data then you will be debating the internet to make your case. The internet is made up of anecdotes and it will get very messy.
A corollary is not to use anecdotes yourself. “Many people requested this change” is in fact an anecdote so is “people prefer” and “feedback we received.”
If you don’t have data then supporting changes with a strategy, point of view, or related business case can be useful. Making changes that might be unpopular is part of the job but if you don’t offer anything the internet will make up a reason and you won’t like it.
The most difficult part of communicating change is the people listening and engaging are almost never fully representative of your entire user base or even target for change.
Using data to show that can help. Intellectually this is understood, but emotionally not usually.
Personal view. Write the long blog post. Maybe you choose not to publish it, but if you write it then you will know all you will face.
You might show the post to detractors, reporters, or some outsider to make sure all views are covered.
Sometimes when you make a change you don’t have to make a big deal about it. More often than we like people just don’t notice. That’s ok. // END
Writing a quality product update is an important part of communicating as a product manager.
Much like writing a great product spec helps you communicate internally, your product update helps you communicate externally with customers, the press, stakeholders, and your market.
I was just helping a client with this issue recently, so wanted to share what I’ve learned helping dozens of product managers over the years. Here’s my best advice for improving your success rate at both getting customers to interview and getting them to show up:
How to get more of your customers to show up for their scheduled customer interviews
You can’t interview customers who don’t set up a time to speak with you.
Or, put more simply: you have a 100% flake rate for the customers who never scheduled a call.
So if you haven’t set up any calls yet, you’ll need to do that first. Here’s where you can start if you’re new to customer interviews:
Ask your existing user base: If you have only 10 customers, go interview all 10. When you have much more than that, you can narrow your focus, but it’s always best to start with people already familiar with your product.
Focus on power users: Every product tends to have some people that are fired up about using it. They log in more, complete more actions, and may even evangelize it to others. These people are gold. One of the best ways to thank them is to interview them and take their feedback and ideas seriously. They often reveal insights that can help guide you to your next stage of growth.
Mix up your methods: Every customer type I’ve ever worked with has been a little different what works best. Try various communication mediums to see what works best (text, email, messages in your platform, Linkedin, etc).
Act on what you learn: This should go without saying, but I’ve seen too many PMs miss the forest for the trees on customer interviews. You should be learning new things in interviews that influence your roadmap, improve designs, and fix bugs. Taking action on what you hear is what signifies to those you interview that it was worth their time to talk to you.
Give credit and thanks to those that helped: This may seem like a small thing, but it is a big deal. Customers *love* hearing that you built the thing they complained about or suggested. Taking a few minutes to message them to let them know can go a long way, and is often how you then build relationships where customers will volunteer for interviews again and again.
And if you need more ideas for getting customers to speak with or just need to find your first set of customers, I have a post that will give you tons of ideas: 95 ways to find your first customers.
Rules of thumb to remember when interviewing customers:
Before we dive into the tactics to use to get your customers to show up for their interviews, keep in mind a few important rules of thumb for these interviews:
It’s hard to start from scratch: If you’ve never interviewed customers before, it will take time to get your customers used to talking with you. The first ask will have the lowest response rate, and then it will get better from there.
Your industry matters a lot: B2B customers are typically much easier to get calls with than B2C (consumers), but that varies, too. Think about your customer and how often they’re by a computer or phone and what their schedule is like. The more they are available and near a phone/computer, the easier to get calls, while the less they are, the harder interviews will be. So yes, it’s harder to interview college students than an IT department. But it’s also harder to interview a construction worker than a retiree.
How you ask matters, too: Being friendly, explaining what’s in it for them, and making it as easy as possible makes a big difference, too. You should experiment on the best methods and wording to ask for interviews just like you’d test other messaging in your product and emails.
Ask the right people: Make sure you know who you want to talk to and why. Power users are more likely to speak to you, as are those who are most motivated to use your product (like a sales rep mandated to log their calls) and have been using it. Asking people who never log into your product will both be harder to get on the phone, and have fewer useful insights (unless you’re specifically trying to learn how to activate users of their type).
All of this is to say that practice and persistence makes perfect; it takes time to master the entire process of interviewing customers, but the rewards are huge. You’ll make better product decisions, improve your product, and gain insights that can improve every team and department.
Fixing the flake rate: How to get more customers to show up to your interviews
No matter what you do, some customers won’t show up to your interviews. It’s an unfortunate fact of life. Emergencies come up, conflicts hit their schedules, and some people flat out forget.
Yet, there’s a tolerable amount of flaking, an expected amount of flaking, and then amounts that make it too hard to do your job, and leave you and colleagues feeling frustrated.
The rule of thumb I like to use is that in an easy to reach, engaged audience in B2B, 10% is a good flake rate (meaning 1 in 10 calls scheduled is a no-show), while in B2C and other difficult industries, a 40% flake rate is not unusual.
Regardless of your industry, we want to make that number as low as we possibly can. These tactics will help you accomplish that.
Oncehub and Calendly are your friends.
Before we get into the nitty gritty details, it’s important to call out the most important tool in the process of scheduling customer interviews: your scheduler.
If you work in tech, you probably use Calendly, and if you’re really old school, you may remember the old days of Tungle, who invented the tech back in ~2009. I personally use a tool called Oncehub, which I find more robust and customizable than Calendly, but both will work.
The key with either is that they automate parts of the process you don’t want to have to do yourself like:
Proposing times you can make based on your current schedule in any moment.
Creating a calendar invite and sending it to your interviewee and any colleagues joining.
Avoiding any double bookings no matter when your customers are ready to find a time.
Handling reminders, and easy rescheduling for the customer.
And if you’ve ever used them, I’m sure you can think of other benefits as well.
All of their functionality turns many frustrating back and forth emails into a few quick clicks and you’re done. And unless your customers are egotistical VCs on Twitter, they’ll be grateful to have something so simple and fast to use. (…and a dirty secret about VCs is that the same people who *hate* calendar scheduling links have assistants who *love* to use them.)
Tweaks to Your Customer Interview Scheduling Process to Reduce Flaking
Ok. Now that you have a calendar scheduling tool set up, let’s go check those settings so that you maximize the chances that the majority of your customers who schedule a time will actually speak with you.
1) Set a lot of reminders:
Your first instinct may be to minimize reminders. You sent a calendar invite, right? You make all the meetings and events on your calendar, so your assumption is everyone else is the same.
That’s a rookie mistake.
Instead, set multiple reminders: 24 hours before, 1 hour before, and 10 minutes before is a your best bet. This makes sure the day before they see, “oh right, I’m supposed to talk to [your company] tomorrow.” Then, the 1 hour and 10 minute reminders ensure you’re at the top of their inbox and they are less likely to get sidetracked and forget.
Even if you think they’d be annoying, realize these reminders really help you out, so take advantage of the fact scheduling tools will automatically send these for you….if you turn them on.
2) Ask for a phone number at sign up, then call them:
You may use Zoom or MS Teams or Google Hangouts for all your calls at work, but that doesn’t mean your customers always do. For any number of reasons they may be unable to or unfamiliar with the technology.
And even if they are familiar, there may be times they have issues with the system working due to spotty internet, not being near a computer, or IT restrictions. You never know until you lose some calls because of it.
However, unfortunately many customers who miss calls never tell you why they didn’t make it.
That’s why the best thing you can do is ask for their phone number when they sign up for a call, so you can call them instead of wait for them to dial in.
3) Offer a gift card or credits for their time:
One of the easiest ways to recruit more people to speak to you is to offer them a reward for their time. This is particularly helpful when you’re working on a consumer product.
This can also often help with flake rates, too, because people are more likely to show up when they have a reward they’ll get after.
Just realize there’s quickly diminishing returns on this; while $20 might work better than $5, you typically won’t find much difference between $20 and $50, or $50 and $100. The exception is if you’re trying to talk to high net worth individuals, or executives; in that case you may need to pay a lot more, or donate the money to a charity instead.
Regardless, offering compensation (or credit with your product) is a great way to not just get people to schedule a call, but if you remind them of the offer, it can help with getting fewer of your interviewees to no-show.
4) Remind them what the purpose of the meeting is in the title, description, and initial ask:
As you’ve likely learned in building products, the little details matter, and they add up. Getting the details right in your customer interview reminders and calendar invites is no different.
Assume that your customers are busy, distracted, and thinking about a lot of other things, which means repeating all the most important details will help.
Go through your calendar scheduling tools settings and:
Make your title for the calendar event something clear and descriptive (i.e.- “[Your company] product interview about [Feature]”)
Put in the description all the key information about the event to further jog their memory and remind them of the reward they’ll get (i.e.- “You scheduled this call so we can talk to you about your experience with [Feature]. As a thank you, you’ll receive a $X gift card for your time.”)
Put all this info in the reminders, too. Remember those 24 hour, 1 hour, and 10 minute reminders? Usually you can add a note or customize them, so add the same info there, too.
You never know what your customer will or will not look at, so by always having the most useful information, you avoid them saying, “Who the heck is Joe and why did I agree to call with them?”
5) Configure messages to come from your email as much as possible:
Your interviews are a chance to build a relationship with your customers. One of the best ways to do that is for them to feel like they can reach you.
Sending messages from “noreply@” and default systems feel impersonal and prevent your customers from reaching you directly. This can rob you of all kinds of valuable opportunities:
Questions or concerns they have before speaking with you (which if unanswered they just won’t show up)
Feedback about your product. Most feedback never makes it to the PMs who can do something about it, so the best thing you can do is give your customers a direct line to you to cut out all the middlemen.
Where possible, swap any default email addresses and noreply@ systems for your own email, or an alias you can forward to you.
6) Resurrect some missed calls by sending followups:
There are a million reasons why someone might forget about your call with them. Don’t take it personal.
Instead, assume they meant to make the call and something came up. If that happens, the best thing you can do is follow up. I like to do so twice for anyone who seems to be flaking:
5 minutes after the start time: This is a last ditch effort to get them to join you. Be brief, polite, and simply include the link or dial in info to your call.
30 minutes after the start time: At this point they’re obviously not making it, so now this follow up is a “Sorry we missed you email” which then you give them a link to reschedule to a better time.
Neither of these are perfect, but I’m always amazed at how effective they are.
I find that anywhere from a quarter to a half of my flakes will respond to one of these and ultimately lead to us having a call.
And a couple settings for your benefit:
While you’re in your calendar scheduling tool setting things up, a couple other settings that will really help you be more effective:
Allow for no more than 3 calls in a day. Trust me, you’ll be drained, and this way you can still get other things done in your work day.
Leave a 30 minute buffer between meetings. This helps with any bio breaks you need, making sure you’re prepared well, and avoids fatigue.
With a few tweaks and tactical additions to your process, you can significantly change how often your customers flake on your customer interviews.
How do you avoid customers flaking on your calls? Leave a comment with any other tactics you recommend.
Further Reading:
Want to learn more about having great customer interviews? These other posts can help you:
Always have a script so you ask good questions consistently and learn the right things.
Prep before every call, so you don’t have to ask anything you already should know and can find unique things to ask based on their behavior. Here’s how to make the most of them.
And if you want hands on help creating a repeatable process for interview customers and turning those insights into great products, I’m available as a coach and consultant for a limited number of engagements. You can sign up for a call here, or learn more about my work here.
It’s a good question, and an important one for any good product leader to think about.
While designers work painstakingly on developing their eye for design, product managers have many things they need to master across a wide variety of fields.
Yet, it can be incredibly helpful for PMs to have their own sense of taste; it benefits them and their teams in a variety of ways:
You can more easily appreciate quality work from your designer, knowing what to praise and recognize.
You avoid suggesting ill-advised things that would hurt the user experience or drive your designer crazy.
You can help raise the bar for your engineering team, by making useful critiques during the testing phase of releasing a new feature that otherwise only your designer would.
You can more easily find good opportunities for inspiration to bring into your product from other apps, sites, and tools you use and discover.
You’ll earn the respect of the rest of your product team as they see you make quality suggestions, and catch valid issues.
That all sounds great, but… how do you do that?
Or, if you’re a senior product leader, how can you teach others to have more taste? It’s certainly better to teach it than wait for it to naturally develop.
Today, I want to teach you one of my favorite, light-weight ways to help develop taste as a PM. It’s something I *looked forward to* early in my career when I was learning, and has kept my skills sharp as I now teach others the same way.
Taste Sessions: How to Develop Design Sense in You or Your Product Managers.
You don’t have to be Tim Gunn to help teach people to have better design sense. All you need is a simple routine and a little prep.
What you’ll do is set aside some time for a special meeting I’ll teach you to have. The key components of the meeting are as follows:
Meet once a month: Make it a recurring event on everyone’s calendar so that you know it’s coming and can prepare/anticipate it accordingly.
Choose an app or product category: Each month, choose a category or product type that you and the team will all download or visit and try out. This works for websites and mobile apps.
Ask everyone to note a few things they like and don’t: If you have limited time in the meeting, ask people to prepare in advance. If you have more time, then you can do all of this live in the meeting.
Go over the apps everyone downloaded together: Knowing that at least everyone has downloaded all the apps or visited & signed up for their products, you can now go app by app reviewing them for good, bad, and ugly of each one.
Get specific about the good, bad, and ugly: When you or anyone else bring up something they have strong feelings about, take time to dig into why. Make it a discussion. Why is that interface ugly/clunky/awkward? What’s smooth or delightful about that screen, animation, or feature?
Praise your team members: Praise is like watering flowers. To develop their taste, be sure to call out and praise the things you really like they noted.
Suggest where you can apply this to your product: All of this work isn’t just theoretical exercise. It’s a great way to find inspiration for your product. Challenge your team to think about how the best things they saw can be applied to current and future projects.
I know it’s a cliche on the internet, but it’s true here: in just 7 simple steps, you can develop you and your team’s taste.
Here’s a few more tips around these Taste Session meetings to really run them like a pro.
1) Zoom is GREAT for this!
Too often, remote work makes things harder. I’m still looking for a good way to whiteboard remotely and have the same energy and emotion as being in person.
Yet, in this case, Zoom is a huge asset, especially if you’re looking at mobile apps. When you share your screen on Zoom, one of the options you have is to pair your iPhone, which then means everyone dialed in can now see the presenter’s phone in giant form. This is perfect for calling out little details that you’d never see looking over someone’s shoulder.
2) Have someone take notes and share them across the team
As much as this is about learning about different designs, it’s also about making your product better. Having a record of past discussions with call outs (and if you’re a pro, screenshots) to how these things can apply to your product, ensures that these discussions shift from the academic exercise to the practical application.
Best of all, if you save these in an easy to reference place, when you’re building new features, you have a library of interesting, high quality interfaces you can pull out and reference in your product spec or product thesis. This will impress your designers who are used to having to do most of the work to find inspiration.
3) Embrace your inner critic
The beauty of this process is that it’s fun, it’s easy, and it’s safe. Rather than only talking about products when you’re critiquing each of your team’s own work, you set up a safe place to critique other people’s products.
This helps people learn to be more vocal editors; since the creator isn’t in the room, it’s easier to say something they don’t like or doesn’t work for them just as much as what they love. And a big part of taste is recognizing all the ways you can do things wrong, frustrate users, or confuse them.
Establish the quality bar.
Being a good PM means being willing to stand up when something doesn’t meet the necessary quality bar. You can use these discussions to talk about tradeoffs like this and where your company feels the standard must be (i.e.- When would you delay a ship because it’s not good enough yet?)
4) Share responsibility
There’s not a ton of work to do to run a monthly meeting like this, but you do have an important decision to make: choosing the category or type of app/product.
One of the best ways to handle this is to rotate within your group who picks the app. Chances are, your example will inspire others to choose good categories. All they have to do is let everyone know a few days beforehand and the rest is the same each time.
Remember: Make it fun! You can learn from just about any app category regardless of what your app or software does. I’ve gotten great ideas for enterprise SaaS from consumer games, product led growth ideas from social networks, and many more unexpected crossovers.
5) When it’s your turn, be strategic
When it’s your turn to organize again (as you delegated to rotate through everyone) you should be strategic in your choices; for example, if your team is focused on onboarding experiments, you can focus on specifically looking at onboarding and choose a category and products you think does it well.
Don’t shortchange your efforts on this; leadership by example is one of the most important parts of making this successful. If you take looking at apps seriously, and choose a good category, so will your team. Yet, if you are careless, sloppy, or forgetful, it will be a lot harder for this habit to stick and grow with your team.
6) Encourage your junior team members to level up on their own
If some of your team members are very new to this, give them some reading to help raise their self-awareness and perspective when they use apps. This will help them both have a better critical eye, and most importantly, start to understand *why* they may like or dislike something.
The Design of Every Day Things: This book will change how you look at the products and objects you use every day. This then can translate to looking at software.
Don’t Make Me Think: This book lays out fundamental rules of web design. The title gives you the most important lesson of all: don’t make your users think, and teaches it well through colorful examples.
By meeting once a month, they’ll have time to chip away at these books; every time you meet, they will understand more and more, while not being dependent on this one meeting for their learning. They’ll also likely then impress their colleagues as their critical eye will seem to rapidly improve.
7) The Veteran Move: Invite Design in
I would highly recommend you start out with just you and other PMs at your company (or if you’re too small, PM friends at other companies). It gives you all a chance to get comfortable and sharpen your skills without fear of being judged by others.
However, as you do all get more comfortable and develop your critical eyes, consider inviting designers from your team to join. It’s a great way for your designers to teach your PMs a bit and for your PMs to earn some respect and build more rapport with people they work with regularly.
Keep in mind that the size of your group does change things. Once you have more than 6 people in your group it may become difficult for everyone to get a chance to speak. When that happens try the following:
Keep track of who participates: In large groups, it’s easy for people to fade into the background. Make sure that doesn’t happen by making note and calling on anyone too quiet or seeming to check out.
Call on junior team members first: It’s easy to agree with your boss whether due to intimidation, a demand to be a yes man, or simply wanting to sound smart. By calling on junior team members first none of those things can happen.
Split the group up: If your group is creeping into double digits, it’s time to split it up. It’s better to meet in small groups and everyone actively participates, than a large audience only watching. I personally prefer groups of 2-6, and would split any group larger than 8, but use your best judgment.
While a little preparation can go a long way here, the best thing you can do in these meetings is to be a good moderator. That’s how you recognize people are checking out, ensure junior team members participate, and see when the group is getting too big. You’ll also see who may work best so that when you split your group, you match people up well.
A little taste goes a long way…
Developing the skills of your PMs, or even honing your own skills, can be something that you put off week after week after week. It’s hard to get it to the top of your to do list.
That’s why rituals like a monthly Taste Session can be the best hack. With limited effort, you and your peers or PMs can improve your design sense.
Want help developing the PMs in your org? Feeling isolated as the only PM at your company? I coach product managers to help them be at their best. Whether you need help mastering interview customers, reducing churn, improving your stakeholder relationships, or teaching new PMs all the skills they need to succeed, I can help you.
I was as surprised as they were when I learned that it’s not typical to be able to take notes while also asking the majority of the questions in a customer interview.
To me, it comes naturally. Yet, now that I have taught dozens of PMs how to interview customers and regularly coach product managers, I recognize this is not normal. In fact, I haven’t really met anyone who can do the same.
Knowing this, the questions become:
How do you make the most of your customer interviews?
How do you take notes, so that you make the most of every discussion?
As I’ve helped dozens of PMs over the years master their customer interviews, I’ve noticed a number of approaches that can help, so I’m sharing them here to help you today.
How to Take Notes like a Pro during Your Customer Interviews
Start there, then come back to this post once you have a great script; it’s the foundation of a great interview that brings the best insights and feedback for your product.
Okay, now that you have a good interview script ready, how can you make sure you never miss a valuable insight you hear from a customer? Try this.
1) Have a template you use every time.
A customer interview script is more than just a list of a few questions you plan to ask your customer. It should be a complete template that organizes and prepares you for the interview.
When I make an interview template, it typically includes:
Title area: This includes the person’s name, background, any existing customer and behavior data from your product, and links to relevant information (like their linkedin, any admin profiles in your systems, analytics data, etc)
Introduction: If the customer has never spoken to you before, having a few notes about how you’ll introduce you, anyone else on the call, and the goals of the interview can help.
People: Understand how your product fits in their life. Get to know what their job is like if your product is B2B, or their life around the aspects your consumer product relates to. Best of all, this warms them up as they also happen to be good rapport building questions.
Problem: This is the meat of your customer interview script. It should include a collection of questions to learn about their problems, priorities, and feedback.
Solution: Once you have learned all about them and their problems, the last step is to share any solutions for feedback. This can be walking through a new feature, having them try a clickable prototype, or sharing mockups.
Key Takeaways: I use this after an interview to summarize what I learned. I place this near the top so that I can easily compare notes and find the right interview to reference later.
A little structure and organization goes a long way. The hour or so of prep I do before my first interview to create such a template and then brief prep before each call allows me to get 10X out of my interviews compared to most people.
2) Do your prep ahead of time, every time.
A good customer interview is only as good as the prep you do for it. Not only does that include the template we just went over, but it also includes filling in answers to any questions you can find the answers out on your own.
When you already know something about your customer, fill it out. You can find out many of these things ahead of time with just a little bit of digging:
What are they reading on your company blog and other content?
How and what parts of your product do they use? Which features?
How long have they been a customer?
What support tickets or feedback have they submitted?
Which plan are they on? Have they upgraded or downgraded?
Any recent experiments they were a part of and which version they saw?
This saves you having to ask about these things live on the call, and can lead to unique questions you’d only ask based on what you learn.
For example, if I see they use an obscure feature, or use our product in a unique way, I make sure to ask about that. I also look for signs to determine if they’re a power user or brand new. Both will have valuable insights, but different perspectives you’ll want to differentiate.
Yet, you’ll only be able to pull on unique threads like that if you do prep and research beforehand.
3) Bring a friend.
The best way to take notes is to have a team member join you. It does not have to be the same person for all interviews. In fact, it can be beneficial to rotate through others, so many of your colleagues get the experience.
For example, on a typical product team, you may rotate through:
An intern eager to learn
An engineer that wants to hear straight from the customer
Your designer, who also should be eager to talk to customers
The product marketer launching the feature you’re researching and looking for copy inspiration
Having a coworker from your team with you means you have someone who can not only then take notes, but also ask questions you missed or would not have thought of. As you transition to various steps in your template, pause and see if they have a question they’d like to ask. Often, they notice something you missed, or bring a perspective different than you would, deepening your learning.
4) Embrace a little silence.
Sometimes the best question you can ask is a good pause.
By taking a minute to review your notes to find the next question, write down something important they said, or otherwise take a breath, you give space to your interviewee to think more, too.
Often, the person you’re interviewing will fill that space with more detail beyond their initial answer. This often leads to more great insights you wouldn’t expect, or would have missed if you had already moved onto the next question.
This is particularly relevant when they’re recalling a story or example for you; typically, you’ll first receive the high points from them. With some time to pause, I find you’ll usually hear more rich details, some of which will be extremely interesting and relevant to you.
Important: You need to ask good questions to get good answers from customers. Avoid asking “Yes or no” type questions, which will provide limited insights. Instead, focus on asking “What” and “How” questions, which get customers talking because it requires details to answers them. (i.e. – compare asking, “Do you use [Feature X] in the morning?” to “What prompts you to use [Feature X]?”)
5) No matter what, record it!
Even with the best help taking notes, there is no better record to have than a full audio recording (and video if appropriate). Here’s why:
Easy to review something later. You’ll sometimes have a conversation you want to revisit. Hearing it live is better than relying on your memory, or even the best notes.
Extract exact wording. This is great for marketing copy, as well as copy inside your product. Use their words, which are best revealed in a recording.
Build credibility with your team. Too many PMs make stuff up. To differentiate yourself and build confidence especially with skeptical engineers, sharing the recording of exactly what you heard builds huge credibility.
Important: Always ask for permission before starting a recording. Some will say no (definitely respect that, especially given some state laws require it), but for those that say yes, having it for future reference is priceless.
6) Follow up after.
After the interview, your work is not done! There’s a couple things you should still do to maximize your learnings and customer insights:
Review and clean up your notes: Sometimes your notes will get sloppy in the moment. You’ll jot down the best shorthand you can. Be sure to go back, review them, organize them, and add anything else you remember that you didn’t notice the first time. If you think you missed a lot, it can be helpful to listen to the recording to add more notes.
Add Key Takeaways at the top of your notes: This is the veteran move. By putting your biggest 5-10 takeaways at the top, it will make it much easier to revisit the notes later once your memory has blurred or faded. This saves you re-reading all the notes instead of quickly scanning the takeaways to find the right interview.
Followup with your customer: Always message your customer thanking them for their time. Follow up on any issues they raised with you, and of course deliver the gift card or other compensation. This is also the perfect time to ask 1-2 follow up questions if there’s something simple you missed asking.
The little details add up and are what really separate good and average PMs from great ones. By following up after the interview, you can fill in any gaps and easily make up for any mistakes or misses during the interview.
Remember: Interviewing customers is a habit.
Becoming great at interviewing customers is a skill to build like any others. You may not be great at it in the beginning, but by making it a habit and practicing these 6 steps, you’ll make the most of interviewing customers.
Fortunately, these get easier and become more natural the more you do them. Your customers also will become more open to interviews the more it seems like it’s a consistent thing your team or company does.
Further Reading:
Want to improve your customer interview habits and learning? I’ve written more on the subject as I’ve mastered them and taught others:
Or, if you want hands on help building an amazing and insightful customer interview process, with help crafting a script, running interviews, and leveraging the best insights to build great products, then my coaching is the best option for you. Sign up for a free call to discuss your needs here.